I’ve always pronounced the word “Southern” to rhyme with howthurn. I know most people say it like “suthurn” instead. I didn’t realize that the way I pronounce it is considered weird until recently!
agghh these comments my eyes the fauxnetics please god why can’t Lemmy have a bigger linguistics community and you mfs wonder why i still use Reddit
There just aren’t many linguists unfortunately. I’m a huge grammar and language nerd but learning IPA takes time and exposure to a lot of sounds you’re not used to. I wish more of the reddit linguists would come over. Even the grammar communities here are dead.
If you start one I will subscribe
I over-pronounce Wednesday. Like wed-nes-day. Most people say wendsday.
Also apparently I’m weird for pronouncing jewelry correctly. I pronounce it like it is spelled, and what it means. It is personal ornaments often containing jewels. Jewel-ry. Not Joolery.
Same thing with Aunt. It’s not Ant. There is a U in there.
It may surprise you that outside of the US, the word is spelled ‘jewellery’ (three syllables)
I’m fluent in both Spanish and English (obv). When speaking English, I’m conflicted on whether I should pronounce Spanish loan words in a shitty English accent like everyone else, or in a proper Spanish accent. So instead I pronounce them as horribly as I can.
Jalapeño is “yah-la-PEEN-oh”. Fajita is “fa-JAI-tah”. Quesadilla gets “QUAY-sah-dilah”
(As a joke of course)
Yeah everyone knows it’s kwe-SAD-il-uh.
Overheard in a pizzeria:
Customer: I’d like a quattro sta… quattro shta… How do you pronounce it?
The Turkish and not Italian waiter: Shtuh gon ee (for stagioni)
Once in a while, I’ll arbitrarily drop juh-LAP-in-oh in a grocery store, just to see who flinches.
Habanero is pronounced jabaññññero.
ah! WITH the doppler effect?
Even funnier because it doesn’t have the ñ.
My wife cannot say empanada. It’s empañada. The locals would always wonder why she was asking for a window.
My family is french/english and we like to do the same with french loan words
In the army it was “Qu’est-ce que le shake?” or so, for “what’s shakin?”
I worked with a guy who did the exactly opposite, in Calgary (and that may explain a lot):
- comPLETEly fluent in French
- would only speak French by imitating those early “Bonjour Pierre!” tapes with the over-done voice pitch.
It was both impressive as hell, and funny. And he’d do this for like a few minutes at a time as part of a conversation. We’d try and get him to break but his vocab was strong (for an anglo) and he’d never break character. I fantasize about him meeting my Parisienne friend and conversing back and forth, her a little stereotypical and him a little bizarre.
I like it!
Quesadilla looks like there’s room to mangle it further:
KWEZZ-ah-dill-ah
or even
kwe-SADD-l’a
like there was saddle in there
You should go the Tralerpark Boys route for pronouncing jalapeño.
.ǝdoɹnƎ uᴉ ƃuᴉʌᴉl uɐᴉlɐɹʇsn∀ uɐ ɯɐ ᴉ ʇnq .ǝɯᴉʇ ǝɥʇ ll∀
Australia is so hellbent on making words sound cute by shortening everything. It makes me giggle even when they are mad.
The sprinkles on bread is adorable
Fairy bread is the best.
My wife has to be careful when picking child names because I will immediately Australianise it to something stupid.
As an American, it didn’t click for me until I visited London for the first time why names like Leicester and Gloucester were pronounced the way they are by Brits. My dumb American brain sees the names as Lei-cester and Glou-cester rather than Leice-ster and Glouce-ster.
oh wow, you blew my mind
Was on holiday in Scotland with my father. And bless this girl at the tourist information who realised that when we stupid Germans said “glennis law” that we meant Glenisla (glen ila).
Unfortunately our linguistic history is a huge tangle and there are few safe assumptions. Depending on where you are in Scotland, the places names might derive from Gaelic, Pictish, Welsh, Norse, or English, and then they probably got Anglicised at some point but it could have happened at basically time within the last five centuries. A substantial number of the non-Gaelic ones are doubly messed up because they got Gaelicised first and then the Gaelicisation got Anglicised. Glenisla is a good example - glen derives from Gaelic, and nobody is sure where isla comes from.
Still, Glenisla is a lovely area! Lots of good hikes there. I hope you had a good time.
It was awesome. Best vacation ever. We went to Glenisla for their comparatively small highland games. They had dancing competitions, bag pipe competitions and of course various sport competitions. Apparently one of the competitors was the reigning shot putting or hammer throwing or so world champion. Every time he threw something the judges went back extra far and still he managed to go beyond the field. He was huge. My father and I dubbed him Monster.
Wow, I’m certain I would’ve done the same. Think I’d make myself a cheat sheet for Scotland and Wales when I get around to visit. Knowing that Cymru is pronounced “com-ree” gave me anxiety about butchering names there if ever I’ll need to ask for directions.
We’ll usually understand if you get it wrong. There’s a lot of extremely counterintuitive ones. If you’re American, the most likely trap is Edinburgh - it’s not EE-den-berg, it’s EDD-in-buh-ruh or EDD-im-bruh.
I’ll also just have to ask that the same grace is returned when I inevitably fuck up basically any place name based on anything Native American, because I don’t know how any of those languages work
I went to school and now live outside Pittsburgh and it’s such a mishmash of Native American place names (Monongahela, Allegheny, Youghagheny; which is Ma-nahn-guh-hey-la, Al-uh-gain-ee, and yaack-uh-gain-ee), French (Duquesne, Versailles; Doo-cain, Ver-sales), and English. Combine that with the Pittsburghese dialect and then mash that with not pronouncing foreign words anything like how they natively would be (but only sometimes) and it’ll make your head spin.
I’m German. One day my house was being renovated and they were working with jackhammers to remove parts of the facade. It was incredibly loud and I couldn’t bear it. I lived close to university and had recently stopped working in one of the institutes. I knew though that my former colleagues had couches in some of their offices so I thought I’d give them a visit. I walked over to the institute and greeted my Australian former coworker. I explained about the noise in my house and said I was “looking for asylum”. Knowing the word “asylum” only from written language, I had no idea it was not actually pronounced “ay suh lum”. He asked “you’re looking for what?” as he obviously hadn’t understood. I repeated “ay suh lum” confidently and he politely said “ah”. Not long after, I learned the correct pronunciation of asylum and that memory has haunted me ever since. It’s been almost 10 years but I still cringe about it.
I understand the feeling, but that fear of being wrong is a plague, it prevents learning altogether. Especially languages ! we should be brave enough to proudly make mistakes and learn from them. Proudly. With pride
English is a bastard language without phonetics so you’ve just got to memorise every word, every phrase, and of course every idiom since half the language is just archaic expressions cobbled together without rhyme or reason (e.g. “rhyme or reason”)
That being said, German has a lot of traps too. The pronunciation of “ee” in himbeere and beerdigung, and guessing the spelling of words using “e” vs “ä” is a nightmare
Living in Los Angeles as a white person, I refuse to pronounce street and city names that are Spanish the English-speaking way. Knowing Spanish since I was a kid from school and using it on a daily basis, my brain simply doesn’t butcher the pronunciation by default.
It’s caused confusion though for sure. I used to live near a street called La Tijera, but Americans pronounced it almost like Spanish “la tierra” which is a completely different word, and I couldn’t figure out where this street was that everyone was talking about.
So, do you call it “Loss Anjeless” or “Lōs On-hay-lays?”
Low’ En’hee-lews
There was a street in the town I grew up in that everyone called “Awkwee-estahh” . It was Aqui Esta, which is a cute street name, but if you pronounced it correctly no one knew what you were talking about lol
That is a hilarious street name, omg
Does that translate to It’s Here Street??
Yeah, something like “it’s here” or “here it is.” With the proper accents the phrase is “aquí está.”
Houston, Texas has a street called Kuykendahl (or something similar). People kept mentioning this ‘kirkendall’ street and I could never find it.
But that’s one where they’re leaning much closer to the Dutch pronunciation
Maybe there’s some vestige there but I asked upwards of 20 people and no one could explain it. Texas did historically have german-speaking communities and even cities, but I wasn’t aware of any Dutch nor had I heard anyone mention it. It’s interesting?
Everything’s bigger in Texas, including linguistic confusion
I say appree-see-ate for appreciate, and artif-isss-ee-al for artificial.
I pronounce dragon as dragòn, if you know what I mean.
I don’t personally do this, but many people in my family say the days of the week with “dee”. Like “Sundee”, “Mondee”. I think it’s charming, but one of their children said they were weird for saying it that way.
Also, as a programmer, there are some words that programmers use that are abbreviated which I refuse to pronounce the way that others pronounce them because I think it’s weird, but virtually everybody pronounces them different to me.
For example, there is a common keyword in programming languages called “enum”, and most people I know pronounce it as “EE-num”, like it rhymes with “ME dumb”. But “enum” is short for “enumeration”, so I pronounce it as if it’s the first two syllables of “enumeration”, like “ee-NUUM”. Although I think the normal pronunciation is weird, I don’t say anything to people. I just pronounce it the way that I think it should be pronounced. But on multiple occasions, other programmers have called me out for it and asked why I pronounce it “wrong”.
There are several other programming terms like this, but they don’t immediately come to mind. Enum is the most common example.
Over time I switched to saying it like you. It’s more internally consistent for me to pronounce all abbreviations the same as the words being abbreviated. That applies to enum, char, var, serde, num, regex, etc.
sudois spokensoo-dooin my house. Where I live alone.I pronounce it the same as you, and by the way, that’s also the pronunciation listed on Wikipedia.
But I can’t remember how other people that I’ve worked with pronounce it. I’m sure it’s come up, but I just don’t recall.
I think the fact that its configuration file is called sudoers is fairly decisive that other pronunciations are wrong.
Do you pronounce “char” like “care”?
I do, especially in VARCHAR as vare-care where everyone else is on the varr-carr train.
I typically pronounce “char” as “character”. Honestly, I rarely have any reason to talk specifically about chars, so it doesn’t come up often.
The next logical question is, then, why don’t I pronounce “enum” as “enumeration”? And the answer is that I often do. But I do say it both long and short.
Reminds me of my highschool computers teacher who pronounced “modem” as “mo-deem”. Because it’s short for modulator/demodulator.
Continuing the programming vernacular, I was waiting to checkout at Best Buy in America like a month ago, and all the registers were empty forcing everyone to check out at customer service by the geek squad.
Someone came up behind me and asked if we were in the place to checkout. I replied, “Yes, this is the queue.”
Shortly after that, he had the same conversation with the person behind him and also used the word “queue” to which the third person asked if he was British, and the second guy just said he repeated what I said so I had to chime in and say I wasn’t British, just a programmer.
It bugs me a bit when people treat acceptable synonyms as foreign just because it’s not the word or within the range of words they would’ve chosen.
I had something similar happen getting off a plane at London Heathrow. I asked airport staff where I could find the restrooms and they replied with a slightly confused look, “do you mean toilet?”
I thought the Brits used Loo? Toilet feels so crass lol
That’s exactly what I thought! I figured that if airport/airline staff there were paid as poorly as in the US (with modern cost of living considerations), maybe it’s more common than I thought at the time.
I don’t get it. Are there other pronunciations for queue?
Their story is more about the choice of words. In America, we typically call it a “line”. In England, it is typically called a “queue”.
I don’t personally do this, but many people in my family say the days of the week with “dee”. Like “Sundee”, “Mondee”. I think it’s charming, but one of their children said they were weird for saying it that way.
My first English teacher in Germany taught us this way as well. She was horrible. Calling kids stupid and such.
One of my biggest pet peeves in programming, hell even language in general, is when people sound out abbreviations. Like they say url instead of U.R.L. Or sequel instead of S.Q.L. Or in Star Wars when they say at at instead of AT-AT. The funniest one is smück for CMYK.
I like saying mumorperger for MMORPG because Yahtzee Croshaw said it that way in one of his review videos once.
Oh, yeah, that one is also on my whitelist.
And Laser.
I knew somebody (not a programmer) who pronounced HTML as “hotmail”. I normally let people pronounce things however they want, but I had to beg her to pronounce it differently because I simply couldn’t deal with it pronounced like that.
“I’m very skilled at C pound”
Still better than “C hashtag”.
I’m a purist. It’s “C octothorpe”
are you guys talking about C-crossword-grid ?
You win. All the upvotes.
I think “hotmail” (the email service) is actually called that after HTML.
How old were they? Because this (top left) may be the reason…
I signed up for a Hotmail account in 1997. I told my mom and she freaked out. She heard hot-male.
I had a specific experience where I couldn’t understand a client request the first time around because they kept talking about some guy named Earl.
I can’t really express how jarring that pronunciation is - you just need to genuinely experience it sometime without warning to truly grok the oddness.
Url and at-at are solidly initialisms. SQL has a solid enough argument for being an acronym that I’ll accept either.
I’ve never met anyone in tech who’s pronounced it any way other than “sequel”, and some of those folks were DB admins since the 80’s.
A lot of our interns and fresh-from-school say S.Q.L. but everyone else is calling it sequel. Usually after a few years even the youth start calling it sequel, in my experience.
It’s hard to say MS S.Q.L. Server, at least in comparison to MS Sequel Server
What I have a hard time with is when they just call it “sequel server”. Obviously, I understand what they mean, but it seems so nonspecific.
What about FAQ?
Most everyone I know says F.A.Q. But I like saying ‘fack’, as in it’s the page where you find the facts.
One I can’t stand is pronouncing regex as “rej-ecks.” I’ve also heard Redis pronounced “red-iss” which also sounds gross to me.
But that’s “regular expressions”, which shortened is rej-ecks. How else would you say it? “Rejects”?
“reg-ecks” with a g sound as in “get”, after all that is how “regular” is pronounced
I think they mean the first syllable is pronounced “reg” like in “regular”, not “rej” like in “reject”. I’m in the rej camp personally. Saying reg is some gif jif shit that feels wrong
So you pronounce GIF as “jiff?” That sounds totally more wrong to me. It’s “graphics” not “jraphics.”
Oh sorry I can see how you would take it that way in the context. No I pronounce it like everyone else did before the creator decided it was JIF, which feels wrong to me. I meant that sentiment is how I feel about saying “reg ecks”
That’s what they want you to think so they can keep all the giraffe gifs to themselves.
It’s the dumb thing about English where g can be like Gremline or like Giraffe. So hard g. The redis one I don’t get through text, though .
Edit: should’ve refreshed before posting since this was already answered (I opened this tab last night)
Fortunately, although “rej-ecks” is common, so is the correct pronunciation.
As for “red-iss”, I think that may be a losing battle. Wikipedia even lists that as the correct pronunciation. I think the rules start to fall apart when it is a project name, and when it smooshes together multiple words.
I sound out Wed-nes-day instead of saying Wends-day.
I hear most people say “library” and I do too, but I’ve met educated people who say “liberry.”
Gotta say it with respect for our Lord Wōden. Wōden’s day
“ee-NUUM” seems like it would roll of the tongue easier than the former and that’s the way I would say it too because of what it’s short for, so I get it!
Spoken language is about communication with the immediate group of people you’re interacting with, and is fluid, so while I agree with the idea you suggest of enum on an intellectual level (as well as several others), using the generally accepted way to pronounce things verbally reduces misinterpretation, so I pronounce things as they are generally pronounced. Spoken language is too ephemeral to be imprecise or use your own flair, IMHO. It’s a communication method that has shared rules, not a self-expression medium that is owned by you alone like what clothes you wear. There’s way more wrong with how the English language pronounces things than a few niche technical terms, but those weren’t decided by any one person. In fact that’s why it’s such a mess, but it’s functional.
Just my opinion from a sociological and practical standpoint. Probably contributing to that, I’m AuDHD and so misinterpretation is something I’ve struggled with my whole life. So precise communication is something I’ve spent a lot of time perfecting, especially at work. For reference, I’ve been a software product analyst, product manager, engineer, and currently architect as well as I used to run a nonprofit focused on ethics in the software industry, so I have had to do a lot of communicating ideas around software at many different levels for decades with both technical and nontechnical people.
So, in my case, enum is programmer jargon and is not something that I’d pronounce at all to a layman or larger audience. I don’t think anybody has ever misunderstood me. I often also simply say “enumeration”. But again, that is still jargon. For a programmer, an enumeration is a data type, and for the layman, it probably just means something like “numbered things”.
Spoken language is too ephemeral to be imprecise or use your own flair
I would say that this is a good rule of thumb.
But then, how do I put this? I think people who are on the spectrum are much more concerned with misinterpretation than neurotypical people. I understand why, as I’ve struggled with being misinterpreted in the past. Being misinterpreted feels like a major disaster. But I noticed that other people basically assume that they’ll be understood, no matter how poorly their message is conveyed. I suspect that you’ve noticed the same thing. I don’t go that far, but I definitely think there is room for self-expression.
In the end, if you understand and feel comfortable with the normal rules, then you can understand where it’s okay to start to break them. Some estimates say that Shakespeare invented 1700 words in his written works. I’m sure that in the majority of those instances, he expected to be understood, despite using a word that nobody else had ever used.
Your fashion metaphor is actually a pretty good one, I think. There is room for expression, but there are also general guidelines to follow. In a typical office environment, nobody comes in to work nude or wearing a toilet seat around their neck. Okay that’s extreme, but nobody wears tons of jewelry like Mr. T, either. What I’m saying is that, outside of high fashion like you see on runways, people do follow a basic set of clothing rules, some of which are social and not specifically practical, and their self-expression is only built on top of that base.
The basic rules for clothing are to conceal certain areas, to provide comfort and protection. That sort of basic thing. So with that, everybody’s clothes serve that purpose. And then, like I said, there are some social rules. You know, like don’t wear a white dress to a wedding. When people violate those rules, other people notice and are often confused. And once the basic purpose of clothing is met, then there are areas for flair. I would say that the same thing applies to language.
I purposely pronouce “download” like dunlaad to annoy my SO.
I used to pronounce “adjacent” as adjuhsent.
How about Chipotle as cheepotole
Friend says Chipoltay
I love this. I say cheese-poodle.
My wife says I pronounce crayon wrong. The way she says it, it’s a single syllable word that is the same as the first syllable of cranberry. I say it as two syllables: cray-on.
Being fully honest, I’ve started drawing it out and articulating both syllables more because I know she doesn’t like it.
You’re correct. It’s two syllables. My wife is from the east coast and says it like “cran” or “crown” and some people here in the Midwest say it as a single syllable.
Dictionary defines the pronunciation as two though. Crayola, the brand that (essentially) invented them, uses two syllables as well per their commercials.
I say it as two syllables: cray-on.
I have never heard it pronounced any other way. Not American though (and I suppose you may not be either!).
“It is called ‘baggel’. I lived in New York.”
