Germany's Greens would deliver Taurus missiles – DW – 11/17/2024
p.dw.com

Germany’s Economy Minister Robert Habeck, who is currently the Green Party’s chancellor candidate in the upcoming elections, said that if elected, he would send Taurus cruise missiles to Ukraine.

Ukrainian President Volodymyr Zelenskyy has repeatedly asked his allies for long-range weapons so that the Ukrainian military can attack Russian logistics centers and military bases far behind the front line and within Russian territory.

But until now, Chancellor Olaf Scholz has chosen not to supply Taurus cruise missiles, saying they could enable Ukraine to also hit targets in the Russian capital Moscow.

[…]

Meanwhile, French President Emmanuel Macron reacted to the Russian air barrage on Ukraine, saying that Russian President Vladimir Putin “does not want peace and is not ready to negotiate.”

“It’s clear that President Putin intends to intensify the fighting,” Macron said.

He made the remarks as he prepared to leave Argentina to attend the G20 Summit in Brazil.

[…]

The French president, however, said Ukraine’s allies “must remain united … on an agenda for genuine peace, that is to say, a peace that does not mean Ukraine’s surrender.”

Macron highlighted that his country’s priority was to “equip, support and help Ukraine to resist.”

  • superkretEnglish
    414·
    1 month ago

    But pacifism does usually mean you don’t join a war where you aren’t attacked yourself.
    Which is the situation the German Greens are in.

    Yes, Ukraine is legitimately, directly, currently defending itself.
    Germany isn’t.

    • gajustempusEnglish
      10·
      1 month ago

      So helping someone who is being attacked and supporting them is “joining the war”?

      • superkretEnglish
        29·
        1 month ago

        Yes, of course it is. Why wouldn’t it be?

        • tobogganablaze@lemmus.orgEnglish
          8·
          1 month ago

          So if you eat at a restaurant, is the chef joining you for dinner because they’re supplying you with food?

          • superkretEnglish
            23·
            1 month ago

            Are Russian factory workers building artillery shells for Russian soldiers not part of the war?
            If they are, then why not also German factory workers building artillery shells for Ukrainian soldiers?

            • tobogganablaze@lemmus.orgEnglish
              4·
              1 month ago

              Russia has declared war on Ukraine, therefore it is at war.

              Germany had not declared war on anyone nor has anyone declared war on us, hence we are not at war.

              • superkretEnglish
                2·
                1 month ago

                Russia hasn’t declared war on anyone either.
                (If you claimed it did while you’re in Russia, you’d risk up to 15 years in prison.)
                So an official declaration of war isn’t a good benchmark for whether a country is at war.

                Boots on the ground is probably the best metric.
                But by that metric, NATO wasn’t involved in Yugoslavia, either.

                When Germans build computer-guided artillery systems, program their software to lock in the allowed target area and muntion-types, deliver them to Ukraine, a Ukrainian soldier clicks a touchscreen to fire it, and when it is worn out or damaged it is sent back to Germany to be fixed, you can’t tell me that Germany isn’t involved in that war.

                • tobogganablaze@lemmus.orgEnglish
                  3·
                  1 month ago

                  Russia hasn’t declared war on anyone either.

                  It has declared Ukraine as a “terrorist state” and announced a “special military operation”. That’s essentially declaring war without using the word war (and Putin has since used the word).

                  Sure, it’s not super solid, but it’s a much, much better benchmark than “boots on the ground” or building and shipping weapsons.