There needs to be trust in the justice system. Otherwise, there’s no point in having a justice system. If he’s cleared, then there wasn’t enough evidence and he should be considered innocent. That’s how our justice system works. Don’t break the social contract because of your vendetta against rich people.
The problem is that our society doesn’t encourage people to immediately report crimes nor provide sufficient support for people who have been abused.
Obviously, no one should be convicted if evidence is insufficient. The issue that I have is that it’s difficult to believe someone is innocent when multiple people have alleged similar complaints. Does that make him guilty? No. But it increases my suspicion. And I’ll never be able to shake that suspicion. It doesn’t mean I want him locked up. It only means that I’m not comfortable with his art going forward. Which is a shame, because he’s one of the best actors of our time.
I’m not saying to blindly trust the judiciary, but that not trusting the judiciary is an inherent failure in society. We need to fix that, not focus on individual cases that will keep happening if our judicial system is morally and ethically compromised.
I’m not saying to blindly trust the judiciary, but that not trusting the judiciary is an inherent failure in society.
Who’s not trusting the judiciary? I for example do think they did their due diligence in not punishing someone they couldn’t prove beyond reasonable doubt that he did the crime he’s accused. That simply can mean that there weren’t enough evidence to proof his guilt. And I think many who still don’t believe his innocence see it similar. With cases about sexual assault this is very often the case simply because of the isolated nature of such a potential crime. It often comes down statement against statement with very little evidence to back either side. And since our justice system rightfully rather errs on the side of the accused, that means that many such crimes will never be proven in court!
That’s the prize we pay for making sure as few people get falsely imprisoned/punished as possible. The knowledge that there are people out there who committed all kinds of crimes but they will walk free because we couldn’t prove their guilt.
But of course that doesn’t mean we people simply have to ignore that fact and treat everyone as innocent until they are judged before a court. So in this case, I find it very suspicious that there are so many independent accusation and I look at the case of Netflix which have won the case of their dismissal of him because his actions on set. To me that’s enough to no longer want want to watch a movie of him and that’s perfectly fine since I’m not a judge trying to decide if serious legal punishment should be forced upon him but rather a random dude on this planet who can’t do shit against him beside not watch a movie of him.
NO! That is how the court system, and therefore the state sees him in regards to punishment and treatment. That does not mean, and has never ever ever ever meant, that being declared not guilty means they are proven to be innocent. Just that there’s wasn’t evidence beyond a reasonable doubt.
Innocence is VERY SPECIFICALLY NOT WHAT COURTS declare. They only ever declare that there wasn’t enough evidence presented to proof guilt beyond a reasonable doubt.
Well maybe we can fantasize about vigilante justice from masked super heroes then. Who somehow can right with punches in the middle of the night what courts couldn’t figure out with extensive investigations.
Or maybe we could get a serial killer to figure it all out and judge Dredd that shit.
Or we accept that our justice system can’t be perfect and accept that there won’t be any legal ramification against Spacey. Sexual assault charges always are hard to prove if you don’t get physical prove right after the crime. That’s even more so when the crime happened years ago. The fact we have to accept is that quite a lot of guilty people will walk free from such a crime.
But that doesn’t mean we all now have to believe he’s innocent and it certainly doesn’t mean we all have to ignore that and be forced to watch further movies with him.
Considered innocent, by the state organs. Considered innocent, in how the state treats them. NOT EVER AT ALL PROVEN innocent by the courts.
Courts are not and have never been concerned about proving innocence. All they care about is guilty or not guilty. Not guilty could mean innocent, but again, the courts don’t care about that.
There needs to be trust in the justice system. Otherwise, there’s no point in having a justice system. If he’s cleared, then there wasn’t enough evidence and he should be considered innocent. That’s how our justice system works. Don’t break the social contract because of your vendetta against rich people.
The problem is that our society doesn’t encourage people to immediately report crimes nor provide sufficient support for people who have been abused.
Obviously, no one should be convicted if evidence is insufficient. The issue that I have is that it’s difficult to believe someone is innocent when multiple people have alleged similar complaints. Does that make him guilty? No. But it increases my suspicion. And I’ll never be able to shake that suspicion. It doesn’t mean I want him locked up. It only means that I’m not comfortable with his art going forward. Which is a shame, because he’s one of the best actors of our time.
I’m not saying to blindly trust the judiciary, but that not trusting the judiciary is an inherent failure in society. We need to fix that, not focus on individual cases that will keep happening if our judicial system is morally and ethically compromised.
Who’s not trusting the judiciary? I for example do think they did their due diligence in not punishing someone they couldn’t prove beyond reasonable doubt that he did the crime he’s accused. That simply can mean that there weren’t enough evidence to proof his guilt. And I think many who still don’t believe his innocence see it similar. With cases about sexual assault this is very often the case simply because of the isolated nature of such a potential crime. It often comes down statement against statement with very little evidence to back either side. And since our justice system rightfully rather errs on the side of the accused, that means that many such crimes will never be proven in court!
That’s the prize we pay for making sure as few people get falsely imprisoned/punished as possible. The knowledge that there are people out there who committed all kinds of crimes but they will walk free because we couldn’t prove their guilt.
But of course that doesn’t mean we people simply have to ignore that fact and treat everyone as innocent until they are judged before a court. So in this case, I find it very suspicious that there are so many independent accusation and I look at the case of Netflix which have won the case of their dismissal of him because his actions on set. To me that’s enough to no longer want want to watch a movie of him and that’s perfectly fine since I’m not a judge trying to decide if serious legal punishment should be forced upon him but rather a random dude on this planet who can’t do shit against him beside not watch a movie of him.
FTFY. Words have meanings and those meanings are important.
Innocent until proven guilty*
NO! That is how the court system, and therefore the state sees him in regards to punishment and treatment. That does not mean, and has never ever ever ever meant, that being declared not guilty means they are proven to be innocent. Just that there’s wasn’t evidence beyond a reasonable doubt.
Innocence is VERY SPECIFICALLY NOT WHAT COURTS declare. They only ever declare that there wasn’t enough evidence presented to proof guilt beyond a reasonable doubt.
Well maybe we can fantasize about vigilante justice from masked super heroes then. Who somehow can right with punches in the middle of the night what courts couldn’t figure out with extensive investigations.
Or maybe we could get a serial killer to figure it all out and judge Dredd that shit.
Or we accept that our justice system can’t be perfect and accept that there won’t be any legal ramification against Spacey. Sexual assault charges always are hard to prove if you don’t get physical prove right after the crime. That’s even more so when the crime happened years ago. The fact we have to accept is that quite a lot of guilty people will walk free from such a crime.
But that doesn’t mean we all now have to believe he’s innocent and it certainly doesn’t mean we all have to ignore that and be forced to watch further movies with him.
The presumption of innocence is an internationally-recognized human right.
Considered innocent, by the state organs. Considered innocent, in how the state treats them. NOT EVER AT ALL PROVEN innocent by the courts.
Courts are not and have never been concerned about proving innocence. All they care about is guilty or not guilty. Not guilty could mean innocent, but again, the courts don’t care about that.