I would say the very second passenger car traffic exceeds the environmental impact of the cruise industry. How much environmental damage does Carnival Cruise Lines do compared to all the highway traffic in the United States? We’re talking an entirely recreational industry here, if all cruise ships disappeared tomorrow society would keep right on rolling. Cases of norovirus would decrease.
You want passenger rail to increase in the United States? Great. Let’s start with Amtrak’s website. I live within walking distance of an active Amtrak station. Several times in my life I’ve had a want or need to travel cross country, and it occurred to me “I wonder if I could take the train.” The answer, inevitably, is no. I go to Amtrak’s website, pick a starting station and a destination station, and usually they outright can’t plan a trip between those locations. Not even capable of saying things like “take the Silver Star to Grand Central station in New York, wait 8 hours, then take the Lake Shore Limited to Chicago.” It proved to be less work on my part to drive, fly as a passenger on an airliner, and fly as pilot of a Cessna, than take the train in this country.
You will if we manage to trigger another mass extinction due to dying seas and you choke to death on clouds of hydrogen sulfide. Or you will care about the environment as you starve to death after our global breadbaskets collapse due to skyrocketing temperatures. We already have WW2-level casualties locked in due to climate by the end of the century. Our efforts right now are trying to keep them merely to WW2-levels, rather than “global nuclear war” levels.
You do not live independent of this planet’s biosphere. You are an animal that exists atop a vast pyramid of life below you, and you are completely and utterly dependent on the services of life below you provides. You are like a CEO saying, “I don’t care what happens to the people I employ. If they die, I’ll be fine.”
My dude, I’m as autistic as the next person on this website, but even I gotta say: You will not make it on the internet if you don’t learn to recognize sarcasm.
If you know there’s going to be a traffic jam at 5PM on the I-Fuckit, aggravated by your presence, is that not intent or, at the very least, gross negligence?
Because as numerous studies have proven, there is no road design for individual cars that alleviates traffic. Period. The design doesn’t exist. Actually addressing traffic would involve severely reducing car lanes and vastly expanding public transit.
Now, if you want to propose going after the car and oil companies that pushed car-centric development starting in the early 20th century and continued despite knowing climate change was real and that car centric development was a major contributor, I’m sure everyone in this group will agree with you.
For kidnapping, the person would have to sequester you and not let you leave. For stealing, they would have to physically take you car. It would probably get towed but I’d hardly consider that stealing.
I get the point you’re trying to make but the way you are going about it is kind of silly.
It’s also important to note that blocking traffic is a form of peaceful protest. If our politicians would listen to strongly worded letters or what the population wants, they wouldn’t be needed.
Stop being part of the problem. Learn what’s in your best interest and stop being easily manipulated. Like how often do you get caught in traffic because of a protest? I bet it hasn’t even happened to you but the media told you to be mad about it so you are.
No. It would be robbery if they stole your car. If you had to leave your vehicle and walk away, and your vehicle was subsequently towed, you might be able to sue them in court for the cost of towing and impounding your vehicle and maybe something for your time. But never would it arise to kidnapping or theft as a criminal matter. You are not your vehicle. It is only kidnapping or false imprisonment if you, your own physical person, are prohibited from leaving.
![[meme] Car brains, citing vague "freedom of movement," often say that it should be OK to run over protesters on highways. In turn, it should be legal to set fire to cars parked in bike lanes.](https://lemmy.world/pictrs/image/b6058a64-70f8-45b0-8431-9b4597d43e94.jpeg){kind=link}
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At what point do carbrains become liable for destroying the environment?
I would say the very second passenger car traffic exceeds the environmental impact of the cruise industry. How much environmental damage does Carnival Cruise Lines do compared to all the highway traffic in the United States? We’re talking an entirely recreational industry here, if all cruise ships disappeared tomorrow society would keep right on rolling. Cases of norovirus would decrease.
You want passenger rail to increase in the United States? Great. Let’s start with Amtrak’s website. I live within walking distance of an active Amtrak station. Several times in my life I’ve had a want or need to travel cross country, and it occurred to me “I wonder if I could take the train.” The answer, inevitably, is no. I go to Amtrak’s website, pick a starting station and a destination station, and usually they outright can’t plan a trip between those locations. Not even capable of saying things like “take the Silver Star to Grand Central station in New York, wait 8 hours, then take the Lake Shore Limited to Chicago.” It proved to be less work on my part to drive, fly as a passenger on an airliner, and fly as pilot of a Cessna, than take the train in this country.
And what part of that is my personal fault?
Oh, well, if others are worse then I guess you’re not doing anything wrong.
If you’ve got to lose weight, you cut out the fat, not the muscle.
If you care about the environment, target the worst, least necessary things first. You don’t genuinely care about the environment though.
You got me, I don’t give a shit about the environment, unlike you, the biggest tree-hugger in the world.
You will if we manage to trigger another mass extinction due to dying seas and you choke to death on clouds of hydrogen sulfide. Or you will care about the environment as you starve to death after our global breadbaskets collapse due to skyrocketing temperatures. We already have WW2-level casualties locked in due to climate by the end of the century. Our efforts right now are trying to keep them merely to WW2-levels, rather than “global nuclear war” levels.
You do not live independent of this planet’s biosphere. You are an animal that exists atop a vast pyramid of life below you, and you are completely and utterly dependent on the services of life below you provides. You are like a CEO saying, “I don’t care what happens to the people I employ. If they die, I’ll be fine.”
Ignorant. Suicidal. Hubris.
My dude, I’m as autistic as the next person on this website, but even I gotta say: You will not make it on the internet if you don’t learn to recognize sarcasm.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Poe's_law
Cars not only kill the planet, but they are erode society so they are far worse than cruise ships imo.
The same point where you are detained for kidnapping for forcing the other cars to stop in traffic.
Next time there is a jam, just throw everyone in jail for kidnapping each other.
The difference between a traffic jam and protestors blocking traffic is intent.
I take it none of you passed high school civics?
If you know there’s going to be a traffic jam at 5PM on the I-Fuckit, aggravated by your presence, is that not intent or, at the very least, gross negligence?
Is that the drivers’ fault, or the highway engineers’ fault? Why isn’t the highway designed to handle anticipated traffic?
Because as numerous studies have proven, there is no road design for individual cars that alleviates traffic. Period. The design doesn’t exist. Actually addressing traffic would involve severely reducing car lanes and vastly expanding public transit.
Now, if you want to propose going after the car and oil companies that pushed car-centric development starting in the early 20th century and continued despite knowing climate change was real and that car centric development was a major contributor, I’m sure everyone in this group will agree with you.
At some point you have to take responsibility for your own actions.
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At this point it’s clear you’re just trolling.
Sure. Whatever.
The guy who thinks being delayed by a protest is tantamount to kidnapping and murdering is casting aspersions on other’s education.
The moment the protestors barricade your doors and physically prevent you from leaving your vehicle.
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I guess it’s all criminals leaving these signs around then.
Theft requires the intent to permanently deprive, not the intent to momentarily inconvenience.
Nothing’s stopping a driver from getting out of their car and walking away. So never.
So I ask again, did the protesters just steal a car?
…no. if you leave your car somewhere is it stolen?
If I leave my car somewhere because a group of people gave me no choice but to do so, yes it is stolen.
Are you planning to do this? Do I need to contact the authorities?
For kidnapping, the person would have to sequester you and not let you leave. For stealing, they would have to physically take you car. It would probably get towed but I’d hardly consider that stealing.
I get the point you’re trying to make but the way you are going about it is kind of silly.
It’s also important to note that blocking traffic is a form of peaceful protest. If our politicians would listen to strongly worded letters or what the population wants, they wouldn’t be needed.
Stop being part of the problem. Learn what’s in your best interest and stop being easily manipulated. Like how often do you get caught in traffic because of a protest? I bet it hasn’t even happened to you but the media told you to be mad about it so you are.
So its robbery then.
No. It would be robbery if they stole your car. If you had to leave your vehicle and walk away, and your vehicle was subsequently towed, you might be able to sue them in court for the cost of towing and impounding your vehicle and maybe something for your time. But never would it arise to kidnapping or theft as a criminal matter. You are not your vehicle. It is only kidnapping or false imprisonment if you, your own physical person, are prohibited from leaving.
You must leave $20000 in my care else you cannot leave. Sounds like extortion.
You’re in c/fuckcars buddy. Read the room.
Or when is blocking an ambulance murder?
Never
Would you make the same argument for emergency services closing lanes to responds to an accident?