At least 274 Palestinians were killed and 698 wounded in Israeli strikes on the Nuseirat refugee camp in central Gaza, Gaza’s health ministry said on Sunday. The Israeli military said its forces came under heavy fire during the daytime operation.
The EU’s top diplomat, Josep Borrell, called it a “massacre”, while the UN’s aid chief described in graphic detail scenes of “shredded bodies on the ground”.
“Nuseirat refugee camp is the epicentre of the seismic trauma that civilians in Gaza continue to suffer,” Martin Griffiths said in a post on X, calling for a ceasefire and the release of all hostages.
How many terrorists would you be willing to let die in order for the military to rescue your kidnapped child?
There isn’t a number too high for me. My child is worth infinitely more than kidnappers.
Like this 6-yo terrorist
If your parents are a terrorist, they made poor choices which led to your death.
Blood hungry psychopath.
I think i’m slowly turning antisemitic
I sincerely hope this is a poor attempt at a joke because that kind of statement has contributed directly to the current situation. It is not antisemitic to criticize the Israeli government, Zionism, or the IDF and its actions. It is antisemitic to say the reason you are criticizing those things is because they are all Jews.
Conflating those two not only makes it impossible to speak out against the atrocities being committed, it makes violence worse against Jews.
It is not antisemitic to criticize the Israeli government, Zionism, or the IDF and its actions.
This is not the narrative that Israel is pushing or that the U.S. adopts legally.
Zionists are royally screwing over the Jews.
It’s fucked up, Zionists say “all Jews support Israel because Israel IS Judaism” then when a Jewish person is attacked for what Israel does they say “see, it’s the proof they’re anti-semites, they attacked a Jewish person outside of Israel, if they were truly only against Israel they wouldn’t have done that”
Zionists are literally using all foreign Jews as human shields. Putting them up as defacto Israeli representatives, then as martyrs.
That’s well said, and on top of that Zionists actively stoke the flames of Judeophobia!
I wonder if there is a number at all for which hammas would say “you know what, holding 100 hostages is just not worth so many dead people of our people, maybe we should just give them back”
The hostages are mere pawns leveraged by both military organizations and specifically by the IDF to justify the ongoing genocide. The IDF was killing their own citizens on October 7th alongside Hamas, and the Israeli government themselves issued that report. Israeli blockading of food supplies starves the Israeli hostages alongside the Palestinian civilians.
Why would Hamas ever give up hostages if this is how Israel acts towards their own captured citizens now?
“Ongoing genocide” The moment hammas is de weaponized and hostages are back all this would stop.
“Blockading food” The state of Israel just presented today to the supreme court that 6000 truck per months entered gaza since hmammas started this shit. Thats not blockade.
If Israel wanted to genocide gazans it could use much more efficient methods for this.
To add to that that BY HAMMAS numbers they had 19000 of their own killed by now. That’s about 1:1 (taking hammas claims for 35000 people killed so far) ratio to civilians so far. Pretty damn good for any military world wide. This is not how genocide lools Like.
The state of Israel just presented today to the supreme court
Investigating myself and presenting evidence to me that I have done nothing wrong, then acquitting myself of all charges. Then passing a law that says anyone who questions my ruling is a member of Hamas.
BY HAMMAS numbers they had 19000 of their own killed by now
I’m excited to see your citation on this.
hammas would say
Who in Hamas would say this? Is there any kind of leadership structure that hasn’t been carpet bombed out of existence already? How would any two members communicate with one another absent an IDF strike team murdering anyone in a city block’s radius from the call?
obviously yes or the iron dome wouldn’t still be shooting down rockets
Perhaps the IDF needs to stop bombing Lebanon first
Why were they holding military hostages in a refugee camp?
Israel detains many Palestinians including hundreds of minors without charge, on bases right in the middle of civilian towns. Heck, IDF headquarters is right in the middle of a civilian neighborhood in Tel Aviv. Does that mean Tel Aviv is a legitimate military target?
Is there an active battle in that area? Or is that a secure area far from conflict? Because it sounds like your contention here is that Palestinian hostages are held in secure bases far from conflict. If I were a hostage and had a choice, I’d prefer to be where there isn’t fighting.
You’re missing the point completely, the Israeli military knowingly puts their bases in civilian areas knowing they are targets by enemy forces, putting the surrounding civilians at risk.
Is there a source for that motivation? Knowingly seems unfounded.Edit: I may be misunderstand whatever your point is. Are you trying to say that whoever puts military bases near civilians is willfully endangering civilians? I think considerations about threat of attack come into play, and how great that risk is. Let’s also not forget people can choose to live around there or not. I mean, there are plenty of military bases in the US that are not under threat of attack. Is the US trying to endanger it’s civilians? That seems ridiculous. Equally as ridiculous is the idea that Israel chose to put bases where they were going to be attacked in the future.
Are you trying to say that whoever puts military bases near civilians is willfully endangering civilians?
Yes according to Israeli logic based on what they say about Palestinians and Lebanese. Their behavior is hypocritical.
I think considerations about threat of attack come into play, and how great that risk is.
Hamas, Hizbullah, and Iran have all directly targeted these military installations, some in cities, and Israeli PR hollowly complains about how civilians are put in peril.
I don’t think you have an understanding of their military choices to make that claim, and I’m kind of confused as to your point so I’m going to cut to the chase. Are you suggesting it’s ok that Hamas does this because Israel has (not equivalently, let’s not get ahead of ourselves and say I agree with you)?
Edit: because you’re getting fiesty with me in the other comment, I’m not continuing this with you.
To maximize civilian casualties, obviously. Hamas profits off the deaths of Palestinian civilians, so why wouldn’t they want civilians to die?
They’re now trying to come up with a justification to attack the pier Biden installed to prevent aid from getting in. So Palestinians will starve. Then people will be outraged and donate more money to Hamas. There’s no downside for Hamas psychopaths.
Yep, and the agencies disseminating these things come from a typical cast of characters (hello Turkey and Iran!). It’s great that more aid is getting to Palestinians.
US-Built Pier Used in Israel’s Brutal Nuseirat Camp Attack in Gaza: Report
According to a report by The Cradle online news magazine, the Israeli forces carried out the assault on Saturday, killing hundreds of Palestinians and retrieving four Israeli captives.
“The troops were then flown out of Gaza via the US-built pier, which had been reinstalled on the coast on Friday after undergoing tens of millions in repairs,” The Cradle stated.
https://www.cbsnews.com/news/us-support-israeli-forces-rescue-hostages-gaza/
Video circulating online Saturday shows an IDF helicopter taking off from the beach with the U.S. pier in the backdrop. Two U.S. officials told CBS News that the U.S. pier was not used in the IDF operation. It is offshore to assist delivery of humanitarian aid. A U.S. official explained that the helicopter landed south of the facility on a beach but not within the cordoned area of the pier.
“The pier facility was not used in the operation to rescue hostages today in Gaza. An area south of the facility was used to safely return the hostages to Israel,” a U.S. official said. “Any such claim to the contrary is false. The temporary pier on the coast of Gaza was put in place for one purpose only, to help get more urgently needed lifesaving assistance into Gaza.”
https://mediabiasfactcheck.com/tasnim-news-agency/
Analysis / Bias
Tasnim has strong links with the Iranian Revolutionary Guards Corps (IRGC) and according to The Guardian the US accuses the IRGC of terror mainly because of its military support for Hezbollah and Hamas, organizations that the US and EU have both designated as terrorist groups.
Although the Iranian Revolutionary Guards Corps (IRGC) don’t openly affiliate themselves with any political parties, the Alliance of Builders of Islamic Iran (ABADGARAN) is widely viewed as a political front for the Revolutionary Guards and they are described as “Iran’s neocons”, therefore we rate the political stance of Tasnim as right-wing bias.
Reporters without Borders has reported Iran as “One of the most oppressive countries” According to the Reporters without Borders 2023 report, Iran ranks 177 out of 180 countries in the World Press Freedom Index.
The content of headlines and articles use loaded words pertaining to national news such as “Battle against Daesh Still Continuing in Cultural, Ideological Fields: Iran’s Shamkhani” However, they poorly source their articles, heavily quoting without sourcing or providing links to the original source. In general, they promote pro-state propaganda and anti-west conspiracies.
Failed Fact Checks
“Shocking evidence of ISIS involvement in the Ukrainian armed forces has emerged.” – False
Overall, we rate Tasnim News Questionable based on the promotion of state propaganda and conspiracy theories as well as the use of poor sources. (M. Huitsing 12/04/2017) Updated (07/08/2023)
Edit: people down vote exposing Turkish state media :)
Where would you prefer they hold them? I mean it’s not like Israel has left them any other choice.
*** And I’m not saying I agree with taking/holding hostages. I’m simply responding to the question you asked.
Maybe in a sectioned off portion of their tunnel system, one where Hamas fighters are defending them without Palestinian civilians in between. I haven’t heard of Palestinians being allowed to camp out in there, so that might be a better place to keep hostages than apartment buildings. They could then keep fighting segmented more easily I would imagine and preserve more civilian lives.
Maybe in a sectioned off portion of their tunnel system
Riiight. After Israel has carpet bombed AND bulldozed much of Gaza.
Show me on a map where you think the in-tact tunnel systems are located.
So you’re saying it isn’t safe for Hamas to be keeping hostages in those areas right? So why keep them there? And they’re underground, some went to Egypt.
Assuming what I said vs what I actually wrote is silly at best.
Ass-u-me
I think you’re responding to a different comment.
No.
So you’re saying
Instead of reading and understanding what I wrote, you decided on your own interpretation of it … which is an assumption.
Where else would it be safe to hold the hostages? The rest of the area is getting bombed to oblivion. Most of the hostages are probably under rubble.
I hear there’s this intricate network of tunnels they hide in.
I doubt the hostages would survive a sponge bomb, you know, the kind the IDF uses to clear tunnels (they built).
So then Hamas has evacuated these tunnels because they don’t work?
What if I showed you how the IDF would destroy parts of Gaza even if Hamas wasn’t present: https://www.aa.com.tr/en/middle-east/no-evidence-of-hamas-tunnels-under-cemetery-destroyed-by-israeli-military-investigation/3123427
So you’re saying it might be a good idea to make known certain safe zones for hostages and not turn those into battle grounds? Who is that incumbent on?
Also, aa is Turkish state media and not trustworthy.
https://mediabiasfactcheck.com/anadolu-agency/
A Bellingcat article states that “AA as a whole can only be considered as blatant and deliberate twisting and distorting of the facts.”
In review, Anadolu Agency utilizes moderately loaded emotional language in their headlines, such as “Merkel slams Trump for ‘harming’ global order” and “Erdogan slams world for ‘failure’ in Jerusalem test.” Anadolu Agency also poorly sources as they typically source by heavily quoting without linking to the actual story.
Overall, we rate Anadolu Agency Right Biased editorially and Mixed factually due to poor sourcing. Further, this is an agency controlled by the right-wing ruling party and has a very strong pro-government state bias. (M. Huitsing 5/25/2018) Updated (11/10/2023)
The particular article I linked is relaying CNN’s own reporting 🤷: https://www.cnn.com/2024/01/29/world/israel-cemetery-bani-suheila-intl/index.html
Israeli commanders failed to prove their claim during a three-hour visit to the Bani Suheila cemetery and the surrounding area.
Because Hamas is just a shitty as Israel. The only difference seems to be that Israel is far, far more effective.
And that Hamas keeps military hostages in civilian refugee campus.
Yes pretty shitty isn’t it.
Do you think it’s an acceptable response to murder 274 other innocent people to save those 4? Are Israeli lives worth more than Palestinian lives to you?
Of those 274, I wonder how many of those will now want to join Hamas for vengeance against the people that killed their families.
I think it’s appalling that the de facto governing body in that area would not find a way to separate their civilian population from known military objectives, instead of distributing them throughout a refugee camp and hiding there themselves (of those 274, there were combatants). I think Palestinians deserve better.
Yes me too.
Again, I don’t believe that justifies the actions of the IDF? What about you?
Perhaps you could stop avoiding the question and either call out Israel as well, or say no I think what Israel did by mudering 274 innocent people including 60+ children is acceptable to you.
We just want some clarity in your stance here. As the consensus here is most people are willing to call out both sides, whereas you seem to only want to focus on one side. Some might say you’re being biased.
Some might say you’re whatabouting my initial question. Something shitty Hamas performs does not have to be met with something shitty Israel does. This is the inversion of the “but do you condemn Hamas” schtick.
As I pointed out, those 274 people involved combatants. If there weren’t combatants or if they were held in a different location than a refugee camp, I would think this operation would have gone very differently.
The Israeli military said it had attacked “threats to our forces in the area,” and that a special forces officer was killed in the operation.
Israel’s military spokesman, Rear Adm. Daniel Hagari, said Saturday the hostages were held in two apartments about 200 meters (219 yards) apart. He said the forces moved in simultaneously on both. Rescuers came under heavy fire as they moved out, including from gunmen firing rocket-propelled grenades, he added, and the military responded with heavy force, including from aircraft.
To address your whataboutism, I think netanyahu has a tolerance for collateral damage that most of the world has a problem with, and we will see what the repercussions are. If I were a family member who’s loved one was taken, I would think this was a success while mourning the great cost this is coming at. I think it’s grotesque to try to simply weigh lives versus lives in a hostage rescue mission in which one side insists on involving their own civilians in the cross fire.
My thoughts on whether this was worth it really are insignificant, I’d defer to the hostages’ families and the Palestinians. If I were putting myself in the hostage families shoes, I’d give anything to have them back. If I were a Palestinian, I’d wonder why both sides are willing to treat us so poorly and resent my aggressors (both sides). This isn’t a black and white issue no matter how much you want to reduce it to such.
And you’re not “both siding” anything, you’re riding the previous comment trying to equate the two by saying Hamas is just as shitty as Israel somehow. And I’m saying that only one side is hiding military objectives and themselves in civilian areas here, which is greatly exacerbating the outcomes.
I’m sorry that you’re making it impossible to have a discussion with.
I have numerous times agreed with your assessment of Hamas and only asked you to either agree that the IDF should be held to a similar standard and you just dance around the topic.
Reporting the Israeli military or governments responses are meaningless to any of us. We all know they lie, they have been caught lying. The same can be said for Hamas statements.
I’ll leave it with the ICC and the ICJ, as again your counter points have been to comment on the innocent Israelis whilst disregarding the innocent Palestinians, which is either due to you purposely being obtuse, or at worst you really don’t care about any innocent Palestinian and you have as much a blood lust as Netanyahu.
Either way I will end the _conversation_here and hope that in the future when we look back on this you will know that you were actively supporting monsters, killing innocent people to aid in killing other monsters.
