• IceBerg@lemmy.world
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    1 year ago

    So you support the displacement of the people of israel?

    1. Where to?
    2. Which people? Anyone who is an Israeli citizen?
    • yesman@lemmy.worldOP
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      1 year ago

      You know, when you advantage a hypothetical displacement over an ongoing one, the implicit argument is that Israelis are superior to Palestinians. You’re asking: wouldn’t it be horrible for the Palestinians to do to the Israelis what the Israelis are doing to the Palestinians?

      If you think it’s unfair to displace one oppressed people in favor of another, then yea, I agree.

      • YtA4QCam2A9j7EfTgHrH@infosec.pub
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        1 year ago

        And the slogan is “Palestine will be free”. It isn’t that Israelis will be exiled or some shit. It is a call for liberation of all people.

            • ParsnipWitch@feddit.de
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              1 year ago

              At least, you know, they allow people to be gay or have another religion.

              It’s interesting how so many people stan for a place like Gaza and the Westbank. And even call for Israel to be abolished and everyone become a part of a new country called “Palestine” that murders gay people and openly hates people of other ethnicities and religions.

              It does seem to me like these people either don’t know much about the culture and history there, or they don’t care. Which doesn’t fit to the overall virtue signalling to pretend to be on the side of justice.

      • IceBerg@lemmy.world
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        1 year ago

        I think it’s unfair to expect a people to just belly up and die because Jihadists are using their own people as human shields. There have been over 7 times where the Palestinian people have had a chance to establish an actual state. They refused each and every time. So I’m struggling to see a parallel between what Israel is doing (defending its people) vs what you are suggesting.

        • archomrade [he/him]@midwest.social
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          1 year ago

          I think it’s unfair to expect a people to just belly up and die

          This makes it sound like Israel’s existence depends on the Palestinian people NOT being free

          • IceBerg@lemmy.world
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            1 year ago

            The Palestinian people have had many many options to accept a two state solution and “be free”. But they will never be free because their leaders only want the distruction of Israel and death of all jews. And, since the people and the rest of the world are intent on critisizing only Israel and making no moves towards freeing the Palestinian people from Hamas, they will NOT be free.

            • ???@lemmy.world
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              11 months ago

              I’m Palestinian, grew up in a Palestinian family, went to lots of protests, “Kill all Jews” is not something people say out or appreciate. The problem is with Zionists, not Jew.

              That being said, totally legal to march in Israel and chant “Death to all Arabs”

              • IceBerg@lemmy.world
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                11 months ago

                Ok. I assume you don’t live in Gaza. Because then you’d be learning antisemitism in school: https://www.jewishvirtuallibrary.org/eu-study-confirms-incitement-in-palestinian-textbooks

                And I assume you don’t go to mosque because then you’d be hearing about gharqad

                And probably didn’t attend these protests: https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.timesofisrael.com/death-to-the-jews-chants-heard-at-berlin-pro-palestinian-rally/amp/

                https://www.ynetnews.com/article/rjdkan0mp

                • ???@lemmy.world
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                  11 months ago

                  Yes, antisemitism exists. No, Palestinians as a collective don’t want to kill all Jews. The Israel government on the other hand is adamant to kill every last Palestinian or ethnically cleanse them with forced displacement.

                  And no, I did not go to those protests, and if I did I would have spoken up about it and not let people chant such bullshit.

                  And no, I don’t go to mosques, I’m an atheist.

                  Ah yes and the antisemitism in books claim:

                  One religious studies textbook asks students to discuss the “repeated attempts by the Jews to kill the prophet” Muhammad and asks who are “other enemies of Islam.”

                  This is a historical event, regarding specifically the Jewish tribes near Mecca. That being said, fuck Mohammed and fuck Israel just the same.

                  A math text showed a picture of Palestinians hitting Israeli soldiers with slingshots to describe Newton’s second law of motion.

                  LOL. What is the issue exactly? Doesn’t say “Jews”, says specifically hitting an Israel soldier, as one should when all means of resistance have run out.

                  Another textbook “promotes a conspiracy theory that Israel removed the original stones of ancient sites in Jerusalem and replaced them with ones bearing “Zionist drawings and shapes.”

                  Yes, good example of antisemitism, haven’t double checked this though and don’t really know what it refers to 🤔 pretty sure Israel ruined all sorts of historical Palestinian sites anyway.

                  About Dalal Al Maghrebi, yeah, that’s bad, I agree, she should not be hailed as a hero.

                  • IceBerg@lemmy.world
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                    11 months ago

                    The Israel government on the other hand is adamant to kill every last Palestinian or ethnically cleanse them with forced displacement. - please show your proof. And please don’t give me quotes from several outliers which unfortunately have been brought recently into the Israeli government. They don’t represent the majority of Israel as apperantly the multitudes cheering in the streets while the October 7th hostiges were paraded through Gaza streets represent the people of Gaza.

    • gmtom@lemmy.world
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      1 year ago
      1. Whatever country they come from or to new palestine if that’s not possible.

      2. Yes, all Israelis

      • IceBerg@lemmy.world
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        1 year ago
        1. Hang on, don’t stop. Which countries? And by new palastine do you mean the one controlled by Hamas who have kill all jews and christians in their charter? So basically just kill everyone who is currently living in Israel?
        2. So all the christian and muslim arabs who are Israeli citizens too. Right? You wouldn’t want to come off as a racist impliying only jews should be displaced would you?
        • gmtom@lemmy.world
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          1 year ago

          1.The countries they came from. They are Jewish settlers. I.e they came from other countries to settle I’m palestianian land. So they should return to the (mostly European) countries they came from. Or they can join they can emigrate elsewhere if they don’t feel safe lying in the bed they made with how they treated Palestinians.

          Just like any other decolonisation effort, the colonisers need to leave or they can stay and try and integrate or face retribution for their colonisation. Are you going to feel bad for British colonisers that got caught and displaced during revolutions in the BE?

          1. Yes obviously, hence why I spoke about Israel and not about Jews. Its a decolonisation effort, so they either leave to their country of origin, emmegrate elsewhere or becomes citizens of a decolonisation Palestine. You trying to imply I’m being antisemitic just shows you don’t actually care about the issue and are just using usual tactics to try and win an argument on the internet.
          • ParsnipWitch@feddit.de
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            1 year ago

            The majority of people living in Israel are not Europeans. Perhaps read something else than just propaganda for a change.

            What do you suggest gay and queer people, muslims and women who want humans rights are supposed to do?

          • orcrist@lemm.ee
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            1 year ago

            Maybe you’re not doing the math on the age of the average Israeli person. There’s been more than enough time since the creation of that country for multiple generations to be born there. They don’t have some other country to go home to, because that is their home.

            • gmtom@lemmy.world
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              1 year ago

              If they can’t return to the country of their or their parents origin, then they need to go through the process of becoming legal citizens of Palestine.

              Having kids their does not entitle them to the land they were born on. Russia has occupied crimea for 10 years now, there will be thousands of Russians that were born there. Does that mean Crimea belongs to Russia? Does that mean Ukraine calling for its historic borders to be recognised is genocide?

              • ParsnipWitch@feddit.de
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                1 year ago

                You do know that the ancestors of many Israelis are native to that area, yes? Why do they have less rights to the land and their culture than the other groups who live there?

                • gmtom@lemmy.world
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                  1 year ago

                  Other than the few that lived their during ottoman rule the vast vast majority of Jews immigrated after the mandate. So the only way they have ancestors that are native is if you go back some 2,500+ years.

                  And if we want to do that than anyone can trace there ancestors back to Africa and you can excuse European colonialism in Africa the same way you are excusing Jewish colonialism.

                  • ParsnipWitch@feddit.de
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                    1 year ago

                    The vast majority of Sabra have ancestors who fled and were exiled from Muslim countries in the region. More than half of the Jews living there are Mizrahi, many have ancestors who are native to the area. An additional 20 % of Israeli are Arabs who have ancestors in the diverse ethnic groups who populated the area, long before the land was separated into Israel and Palestine.

                    The separation between Israel, Westbank and Gaza is more a religious than an ethnic one. Since Gaza and Westbank want a pure Muslim state. But original the are la wasn’t pure Muslim. The ongoing conflict between the Muslim and non-Muslims groups in the area predates the separation and was one of the factors which led to the founding of Israel.

                    The idea of European colonizers is just propaganda used to paint a black and white image of the situation.

    • bdonvr@thelemmy.club
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      1 year ago

      From the River to the Sea does not necessarily insinuate that all Israelis will be displaced, killed, etc.

      At minimum, the Israeli state should be abolished. I think first generation settlers who aren’t refugees and can return to their home country should probably leave.

      • IceBerg@lemmy.world
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        1 year ago

        Please go on. Where should the jews go? Which countries in the world would gladly accept 7 million jews? And by abolishing the Israel state I assume you are a big supporter of Sharia law. So no women rights, all LGBT people should be put to death, etc…