I feel like trying to frame men’s mental health issues as a problem caused exclusively by “the patriarchy and capitalism” seems like it’s trying to wash the rest of society of their own personal responsibility to contribute to making the world a better place for everyone. Patriarchy and Capitalism are just tools of the greater power structure of society, which we all have a hand in forming and perpetuating.
And let’s not pretend that the feminist movement’s tendency to pump out and empower misandrists and misandrist thinking isn’t going to have a negative impact men’s mental health, especially if we continue to hold feminism as a scared cow beyond reproach or criticism. And let’s not pretend the fact that we have the explicitly female coded “feminism” that opposes the explicitly coded “patriarchy” isn’t going to give people who don’t have a lot of time to philosophise an inherently combative view of the feminism.
It’s hard to buy into the whole “actually femismim is for anyone who wants equality” shtick when you’re working exhaustive jobs most your life and then you get exposed to the kind of feminist who says men might as well go extinct because they have sperm banks now.
Pretty much every problem we have in modern society stems from patriarchy and capitalism. It is the wrong tool for the job. Hang on… let me hammer in this screw real quick. It might damage the porch I’m building, but it’ll work I guess.
I don’t think this engages with the topic of men suffering under patriarchy.
Many men in society are deeply unhappy, in large part (i would argue) because they fail to live up to masculine stereotypes. Telling men who have shitty jobs, no friends, and no dating life that their problems are their own fault solves absolutely nothing and at worst further isolates and radicalizes them. Men suffer under the patriarchy too, and those who suffer most do not have the power to dismantle it.
I understand that telling people to be kind and compassionate towards people who perpetuate their oppression can come across as insulting but I genuinely think it is necessary. We cannot solve our problems simply by pointing fingers.
Pointing fingers is a necessary step in identifying the problem, and the problem is the system itself and the people who run it. You can’t have infinite growth in a finite system. It’s not logical, let alone possible. And since we are living in a patriarchy, yeah, I’m pointing fingers. It’s not men individually that are the problem. They are subject to the same stereotypical gender roles as women. It’s the archaic idea that men have to be the bread winners and protectors while the women stay home and pop out kids. It’s great for the economy after all.
The American Dream died when Reagan was elected, but for some reason, it’s still dangled like a carrot. The patriarchal society started when organized religion became a thing. The big 3 religions are patriarchal by nature. It’s written in doctrine. They have a lot of influence in politics. Christianity specifically. God said, “take of the earth. Go forth and multiply.” See? Capitalism is written into the very foundational teachings Christianity, a patriarchal religion, with more than their fair share of political influence. It’s too much stress for the human psyche to handle, and now there is a nation of people struggling to live up to standards that are complete nonsensical fairy tales. Not a good thing for mental health.
Patriarchal Capitalism had its run. Now the world is burning and flooding at the same time. It’s a failed system.
I generally agree with what you’re saying. Identifying who is perpetuating these issues is important, but I would argue understanding why they perpetuate them is more important. Patriarchy IS a problem, late stage capitalism IS a problem. But simply identifying those problems solves nothing. More important and interesting questions to me are: Why does the patriarchy exist and how can we dismantle it? And is there an alternative to capitalism and how to we implement it?
As much as I hate capitalism I have yet to hear a single viable alternative, I only hear how bad it is. Personally I think capitalism has incredible benefits for society and with regulation and an all encompassing social safety net is a ‘fine’ system.
Except that since our world is not infinite, capitalism will be the end of it. Corporate control and ownership of the country is what needs to end. Trickle down economics are a lie that just sucks the wealth out of our economy and puts it in the pockets of the wealthy elite. Because of this, our children will suffer the consequences for the rest of their lives, and their kids, and their kids, until there are no more natural resources, no more middle class, and no more breathable oxygen.
The only way to stop it is by taxing corporations at least 70% and shifting the control of these corporations to the state, completely outlaw all religious influence in politics, and redistribute the wealth back into the economy with monthly stimulus checks to all adult citizens. The taxes on corporations would be more than enough to pay for universal Healthcare, food for the poor, housing for the homeless, and free education.
So, either we need a modernized version of communism with protections in place for the populous, or we continue with capitalism and increase funding to social programs. That will never happen under our current system, so we are doomed.
It’s such a touchy subject because feminism definitely came about as a response to toxic masculine behaviors that have been around and are still with us. And while capitalism/toxic masculinity is to blame for most of men’s mental health problems, at the same time, I think there’s still been something of an overreach with feminism and there’s actually some aspects of Western life where women are at a definite advantage, namely in the Court systems when dealing with divorce and custody issues. Men and women in these spaces are not treated equally and it’s just accepted as “That’s how it is,” because we’re ok with going off of outdated ideas in that space.
Having said all that, I still don’t think it’s fair to blame feminism for men’s mental health issues, it’s more just a societal thing that men in general are really considered expendable and left to fend for themselves on most of their problems. While I think it’s gotten better over the years and it’s more acceptable to at least talk about some things, there’s still just a general apathetic attitude towards men’s mental health issues. Men/Fathers will often be relied on by everybody else in the family for all sorts of things, but who does Dad have to turn to when he has problems? Mothers are often placed on a pedestal, and that’s great for them, fathers though are just kind of… “Oh, it’s you.”
I agree with you fully. I am a feminist, and I absolutely agree that certain portions of our community has been co-opted by toxicity.
Yes, it sucks to be a woman, especially if you live in a region where you’ve lost access to your bodily autonomy, because that is the barest of basics for rights. It sucks getting paid less. It sucks having to maintain a job, maintain the household, be the responsible parent for getting kids to/from school/practice/clubs, etc. It sucks being the spouse that’s EXPECTED to stay home and forgo their career/dreams if a dual income household doesn’t make sense (childcare costs eat up a spousal income). It sucks being the sex that is more likely to end up abused/murdered/raped.
I hear all that. But I do believe that mainstream feminism has DEFINITELY crossed the lines in certain aspects.
I don’t think it’s necessary to jump all over a man’s comment when he says “I’ve never beat a spouse/I help out around the house” and reply with silly things like “nOt AlL mEn” and shit like that. It makes people feel unheard and undervalued. And if people feel unheard/undervalued, they are going to gravitate to where they do feel valued and heard.
That’s how we end up with manosphere bullshit saying things like “A woman’s pleasure isn’t necessary, but a man can’t think straight without it. It’s her role to keep you satisfied and fuck anyone else who says otherwise.”
“Looksmaxxing” is something that I’m also REALLY fearful of our younger male generations getting into, because it stems from “You wanna get laid? You gotta be hot or a woman will NEVER choose you. This is how you get hot.” And then it leads young men to picking themselves (and each other) apart physically to a really harmful level.
Ughhhh, I know I’m saying a lot here, but it’s because I do believe that certain traits of current day radical feminism are driving more and more youth to the Andrew Tates of the world, and that makes me terrified for our younger girls growing up alongside them, and how they’re going to be treated.
Women couldn’t get their own bank accounts in the US until 1970, radical feminism was necessary. But today, we have to make sure men feel comfortable talking to us/being supported by us/delving into their hopes and dreams without being like “Okay but it’s worse to be a lady”.
We have to support each other.
I believe a lot of it comes from engagement-grinders constantly pushing rage-bait for clout and clicks. Gender war and revenge sells more than that hippie shit.
Facts tho.
It’s always the dudes who are only friends with other dudes that have the most issues.
More of a cultural thing than anything, but it’s always good for dudes to have women as friends as well, women are just better at talking about some things. They don’t have the same social hangups as a lot of men.
Shits better than it was, but it’s still weird when people only have friends of their own gender.
Same thing with other types of bigotry. The more people you know and/or have to interact with from different ethnicities or backgrounds, the harder it is to blindly hate them. You see this a lot in more diverse places like cities where they tend more progressive and tolerant. And you see the inverse in more remote or rural places that are often more homogenous.
